Here's some videos that I have started to compile. These vids try to explain how the games link together. Silver Case シルバー事件 Lunatics Kill the Past part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3ba_sAneAM Killer 7 Kill the Past ending http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5O6XV3ocKXg I really don't think that killer7 has plot points that are only understandable if you've played Suda's previous games. In other words, killer7 does not tie in terms of plot to previous games. At least not in terms of internal plot logic. True. Most of the spiritual themes in Killer 7 are nothing more than red herrings. They are just common thematic threads that carry over from every game. I can't stress that enough. Knowing how many arguments I've gotten into for believing them to be irrelevant to K7's plot. forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=494" target="_blank">http://killer7.6.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=494 forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=610" target="_blank">http://killer7.6.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=610 There were many other instances, but they happened at other forums. Which is why I never discuss about Killer 7 outside of this website. It does have references, like the pulsating moonlight or the appearance of Ed McAllister and his reference to Garcian's briefcase, amongst a number of others but those are otherwise totally unrelated to previous games. The moon pulsating is just a fragment of Garcian's past, that represents the moment he left Emir behind at the UH rooftop. The moon references the Moonlight Syndrome. Which is why the entirety of Killer 7 is way out of whack, and random as fuck. The brighter the moonlight. The more that the light will influence the sanity of the human mind. The full moon represents the same exact thing in Moonlight Syndrome, Silver Case & Flower, Sun & Rain. So I have no reason to believe that it would mean something else entirely for Killer 7. Especially since every level in Killer 7 started with an image of a Full Moon. Only a couple of levels in FSR had a bright full moon. Silver Case started off with a full moon, has another stage (Sumio Kodai's case) in the middle that directly references Moonlight Syndrome, and SC finally ends with another Full Moon stage. Moonlight Syndrome only has 3 stages with a full moon, and they all occurred during the final half of the game. Ed McAllister's appearance is just so that you know that something's up with Garcian. How the hell does someone from that Hotel know Garcian if it's the first time Garcian ever enters the building? (this would be the right moment for a "...NOT" joke, but it's a lame one so I won't use it.... NOT!) The Ed McAllister/briefcase reference is either directed towards the japanese audience, or/and at the very least, an inside joke amongst the GHM staff. Nothing important that I need to know. Ed went missing after FSR so it turns out that he ended up at the Union Hotel, lol. Ed is just hinting that Garcian isn't who he thinks he is. Much similar to how Sumio Mondo wasn't really who he said he was either. It could also relate to the metempsychosis theme that is heavily prevalent in K7. (As well as SC & FSR.) A transmigration of the soul between hosts. It could imply that the person inside Garcian's body is actually Sumio, but it's all just speculation I've read from a Japanese K7 site that was based off of the original Devil Summoner game. There's a guy named Kyoji Kuzunoha who dressed exactly like Garcian. In DS, Kuzunoha's body was given to the main character after they both died during the same day. Death gave Kuzunoha's body to the main character because it wasn't time for him to die yet. (The main character's body was fubared, so he was given Kuzunoha's as consolation.) The remainder of the game revolves around Kuzunoha trying to get his body back from you. In this picture of Kuzunoha http://www.dokuganryu.com/scans/megaten/devil/02.jpg You can clearly see an aura of a young boy emanating from him. That's the main character. Some people in Japan believe that Sumio is using Garcian's body as an outer shell. Course I don't really think it's true because Garcian is in NMH. Although the logic behind the theory does make sense. The TV, with every persona inside means quite simply that those personas aren't even real people to begin with. It may or may not be a reference to Moonlight Syndrome, but who cares? It doesn't matter. I see all of those things as idiosyncrasies, if you will - not plot points. IMO, the tv medium in Killer 7 is actually a conclusion to the ending of Moonlight Syndrome. MS never actually tells you why Mika Kishi is stuck inside the tv. (In fact the MS ending is the only time in the game that the tv ever gets focused on.) The only hints that we have to go on are 1. Mika was present during the ending credits. She hugs Ryo Kazan. 2. We later see Ryo lying around dead or unconscious sitting in front of a tv & still holding on to Kyoko's head contained inside a brown bag. (The brown bags in Killer 7 are supposedly the heads of the Smith Syndicate.) 3. You can clearly see Mika Kishi tapped inside Ryo's tv. Silver Case concludes what happened to Ryo & Rumi after Moonlight Syndrome. ----- In Silver Case, during Jan. 29, 1999 during midnight. (SC actually begins during the same duration of time that Moonlight Syndrome ended.) Ryo Kazan goes apeshit insane & went on a killing spree. One of his targets was Tetsuguro Kusabi. Later on in SC, Tetsuguro shoots Ryo about 5 times. However the final shot actually came from Rumi Touba. Rumi is later killed by Tetsuguro, because she failed to comply with his orders. ----- Killer 7 shows to you the final conclusion to Moonlight Syndrome The meaning behind the tv & what actually happened to Mika Kishi. ----- In Killer 7 we later find out that The Smith Syndicate are all dead, & we actually transmigrate their souls into Emir through the use of the tv as a medium. This also explains how Mika was able to hug Ryo during the credits. She was actually a corporeal spirit, who may have been using Rumi's body as a host. Just like how the Killer 7 utilize Emir's body as the main host in order to exist in the physical plane. So in effect it's not that K7 is referencing Moonlight Syndrome. Killer 7 is actually closing the final chapter in the Moonlight Syndrome game. (The only loose thread left from MS is Yayoi Itsushima/Hanayama herself.) because of their experience with Suda's previous games, so they will naturally pick the similarities and thus even theorize about killer7's relation with previous games even if in reality there isn't one. Most people in Japan can't really decide whether or not K7 should be grouped up with the other games. I think the main reason why anyone would believe that Killer 7 relates to the other games is because of the hand book. Hand in Killer 7 actually has the title "Kill the Past" on it. http://www.killer7.3dactionplanet.gamespy.com/handinkiller.jpg http://www.killer7.3dactionplanet.gamespy.com/handinkillerback.jpg Kill the Past was a catch phrase that originated in Moonlight Syndrome, but was later expanded upon in Silver Case. Although it should be noted that Silver Case 25 Ward actually starts an entirely new arc called "Kill the Life" Implying that Killer 7 is actually the final chapter of "Kill the Past" Which would make sense, since it was actually Killer 7 that finally (indirectly) explains what happened to Mika Kishi after she died in Moonlight Syndrome. As can be seen from the MS ending. Mika can also traverse the physical plane like the K7. She too is also confined inside a tv. The tv is used as a medium between astral planes. That's all information about MS that you can only attain by playing Killer 7. As far as I know, the only thing outside the game you really need to understand to figure it out, is US<->Japan politics. True. I wish there were more people like you who understand as much as you do about K7's plot. While the red herrings in K7 do have a meaning & a purpose. (For the overall theme of Suda's games "Kill the Past") They do not have any actual relevance to the core that is Killer 7's plot. Which was a game that had a politically focused plot. (The other Suda games don't focus on politics. Silver Case kinda does, but Silver Case's theme differs depending on what case you're currently on.) Killer 7 takes place in an alternate reality that is separate from the main series. Moonlight Syndrome= The origin Silver Case= The main plot Flower, Sun, & Rain= Plot device that relates to every single game. Killer 7= Alternate reality Here's Flower, Sun & Rain being mentioned in Silver Case. I forgot to scan the part when he says "The answer is in Kamui." In FSR, Tetsuguro tells Sumio that it's time to come back to reality. After Tetsuguro says "Come back to reality." The graphic style of FSR all of a sudden changes into a typical Silver Case interface. Implying that SC is the Reality. In NMH we constantly hear the Touchdown bros. talking about coming back to Paradise. Paradise or dream often refers to Flower Sun & Rain. FSR= Paradise/Dream It's where you run off to in order to forget your past. (Although in reality FSR is just a man made island containing a factory that mass produces silver eyes, by cultivating them through a rare breed of a hyena.) If Moonlight Syndrome were to be referred to through some kind of code name. I would guess it to be "Nightmare", because that is what the Moonlight says after Ryo agrees to the contract with Mitra. In order to lengthen Mika Kishi's life span. Nightmare would be a fitting name, because not only does it relate to reality & dream. Nightmare also aptly describes what the full effect of the Moonlight Syndrome actually is. (A nightmare in the physical plane.) I can't honestly say what Killer 7 would be, because that game doesn't make any goddamn sense outside of the political arc. Regardless of how many K7 fans may think otherwise.

Actually I have a friend that perfectly read Japanese, but he's disappeared, it doesn't make him have been seeing online for months. My sister is fluent in Japanese. She doesn't play Suda games though. She's more of a Suikoden fan. It's funny though, because people usually assume that I'm the one who speaks japanese. (My sister looks like some goth chick from Germany.) Not fair, absurd and not sincere, and the feeling is no different hatn those okami players feeling good by playing okami. How is it the same. Okami is based off of a goddamn japanese fairy tale. (That was in turn based off of mythology.) It's not my fault that people act as if Japanese fairy tales are so thought provoking. Hell people play through Xenogears & Assassin's Creed, & they still come off as deep to the gaming audience. Simply because of the allusion to god (Alpha & Omega) & some other pretentious bullshit. Okami was never trying to be deep or mind engaging. That's the part that pisses me off. It's more or less the fault of the gamer audience who don't know enough about the lore surrounding Okami in the first place. Killer 7 has a surrealist story telling style. In other words the writer wants you to figure out what the real plot is, by showering the viewer with a shit load of irrelevant plot devices that have nothing to do with the game. (David Lynch does it all the time in his movies.) It's your job to find the connecting thread that links the entire story together. In Killer 7 that thread is the U.S. Japan peace treaty. Refernce is one thing, but main plot holes are based on past games. They are references. Although they are references that help you comprehend what is going on in Killer 7 with a bit more clarity. People who got K7 and played through all of it, didnt get story, what they paid for? Yes they did. K7's plot is politically focused. Just because most Killer 7 fans don't want to accept that doesn't mean a damn thing. People in Japan don't understand the story for Killer 7 either. (By story I mean all that religious spiritual bullshit that most K7 fans go gaga over.) Suda's "kill the Past" series of games are an ongoing story. (Like the Suikoden games.) There is no end yet, because it hasn't ended. The games only link to one another, because they share the same characters & take place in the same world & setting. (Except K7. It only has Ed. However FSR links to all the games. So that point is moot.) When you type in Flower sun & rain into this story wiki page. It actually brings you to Moonlight Syndrome, Silver Case, FSR & K7. Because FSR connects to every single game. http://www8.atwiki.jp/storyteller/?cmd=search&keyword=%E8%8A%B1%E3%81%A8%E5%A4%AA%E9%99%BD%E3%81%A8%E9%9B%A8%E3%81%A8&andor=and (FSR has the only person from Moonlight Syndrome who's still alive. K7 had a semi majour character from FSR.) you know i invested so much thought on that tv thing, it seemd so out of place, and the tv was hallmark in sense you change character thru that, in many scene the person changes to other character, nuthing on other forums made sense untill now few days back drunke told that it was spirit chanelling device which made sense. That's because most people around the net make up random bullshit pulled straight out of their ass. Which is why I tend to refrain from looking up anything Killer 7 related in the West. I look for my answers at Japanese websites. Who are almost as confused as the Western audience, but at least they tend to have more interesting, & varied theories. (Which, imo is the point of Killer 7. There are no real answers outside of the political plot.) Whereas most Western based theories are all based off of what they read from the plot faq. Which is mostly fan fiction imo. Seriously if somebody makes another mention about those damn Killer 7 resurrection reincarnated Jesus bullshit theories. I'm going to snap, lol. The tv medium explanation is actually answered in Killer 7, NOT Moonlight Syndrome. Moonlight Syndrome just makes you wonder why Mika is stuck inside a tv. Killer 7 is the game that shows you exactly what's going on with the tv. Whenever Garcian transmigrates the Smiths from the tv medium into his body. gamers with just K7 in their possession will be lead astray easily with numerous loopholes, since these looppholes are taking screenspace frequently. And... Suikoden is another series that contains many plot holes. Most of the time the only answers that can be found are within Suikoden based magazines in Japan, or within the suikogaiden games. Just look at Suikox.com http://www.suikox.com/ & Suikosource. http://www.suikosource.com/ Those two sites are the main English suikoden communities in the web. Yet, *gasp* wait for it* they extensively reference Japan only content all the time. A lot of the shit never made it into the final builds of the game, but they are still canon, because they were originally intended to be in Suikoden. (Like Luca & Jill Blight's background.) Skullknight http://skullknight.net/final.html the most popular Berserk site on the web also references Japanese only content all the time. For some reason it's only seen as a problem when somebody decides to use Hand in Killer 7 with K7. (Or use info from Suda's earlier games to supplement what they know from K7.) I can't stress this enough. For some reason it's against the law to reference japanese material with Killer 7, but it's ok to do that with Suikoden. (Despite Suikoden's name. It has nothing to do with Japan at all. It's utilizes a standard fantasy medieval setting with a twist.) Why is that?...

Loose details, loopholes and all messed up just trying to make ppl feel good that they are solving mystery? specially online like drunkee? WTF is that supposed to mean? Why don't you speak straight for a change, part-nah. Enough with the goddamn veiled insults. You know that I'm an uncultured American right? Us Americans don't have proper manners. I would've bitch smacked your ass straight back to your mama's uterus for speaking about moi as if I get some kind of emotional fulfillment over this shit. If I wanted some kind of quick fulfillment I'd go hire a hooker. Don't act like you know, part-nah. I do it, because I see it as my DUTY. As the webmaster. I seriously need to secede from the webmaster position though, because I'm getting sick & tired of getting dissed for shit. I'm only doing what I do, because I'm the webmaster. (For now at least.) I see it as my responsibility to keep people in this forum informed. If I were just an MPD Psycho, I would probably only post sparingly like Bloody Heartland. (A member who doesn't post much, but the posts he has made have been quite informative.) Why is that, because I wouldn't be responsible for the info that gets circulated through this forum If I weren't webmaster. It's just that simple. Fuck, I get clowned on for knowing a shit load about Persona's back story & now this. I seriously should've stuck to reporting in japanese underground subculture websites. When it came to that shit. I could actually report what I know without getting clowned on, lol. What mystery are you talking about? I don't even view Killer 7 as a mystery. I see it as a physical presentation of a political debate. Nothing less & nothing more. If I really wanted to "FEEL GOOD" than I would constantly strive to increase this website's audience. It would actually be a lot bigger if I bothered to advertise it, but I don't really care about that shit. I just want a secure hub to log my findings at. Notice how every time someone does compliment the work going on in this site. That I usually only reply to them with a one sentence comment. (Indicating that I don't really care about the compliments, good will, or "feeling good" what ever the hell it's called these days.) Hell my replies to you seem to be longer than most of my posts in this forum. How many motha fucking times do I have to say it. Killer 7 impressed moi with it's political knowledge, and how well it was implemented into the plot of K7. Much of what K7 said actually ended up happening in the East a year or two after K7 was created. I do this site for myself. Even if everybody stopped dropping by. I'd still be up on this shit posting & talking to myself, lol. Coz Suda's games are like the second coming of Megaten to me. (What Megaten used to be.) I originally made this website to log the political relevance of Killer 7. I feel that I did a pretty good job explaining the political relevance, considering that's all Iwazaru & Travis Bell ever talk about through out the entire game. Killer 7 shows you a scenario that could happen if article 9 is not amended in time. For the longest time I made a stance to never discuss anything about Killer 7 that was outside the political boundaries of the plot. For real though check out the damn threads in this forum. forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=494" target="_blank">http://killer7.6.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=494 forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=610" target="_blank">http://killer7.6.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=610 It wasn't until I played Silver Case that I finally realized that the games are actually linked to each other. That's when I finally eased down & realized that the games do hold some spiritual elements to one another. I do have reason to believe that Killer 7 actually does close a chapter to Moonlight Syndrome's plot. (I've already outline why in my above post.) Even than the connections to Killer 7 are tentative at best. K7 is a political plot with a lot of dressing on the side. Much similar to how movies like Mulholland drive are really just love stories with a lot of spiritual "red herrings" ornaments sprinkled through out. As a political driven plot. Killer 7 happens to succeed in it's message the most. By not choosing sides for the player. Long answer short... My official stance on killer 7 is that it's nothing more than a political debate in the form of a video game. Bam, that's it your goddamn mystery is solved. I cover the other Suda games, because I prefer them over Killer 7. They had stronger plots, characters, & settings. Most of all they have stories that carry over from one game to the other. It's very similar to the writing style that's most often used in novels. (Most novelists write a series of books that revolve around the same themes & characters, and they're not afraid to kill any of their main characters off.) Oh yeah, that's right. These aren't novels. They're damn video games. So I guess they should be expected to conform to the lame writing style that most other video games derive from TV & Film. (AKA, plots that center around a sole character & their trials & tribulations or what not. Stories like that bore me to death.) Most of all Suda's earlier games had coherent atmosphere & ambiance. Which is something that Killer 7 sorely lacked. What keeps me around is that I love to see how Suda's characters grow in between games. To me K7 is a failed abortion that tried it's best to salvage it's remains. Which is why K7 is so confusing. It's not because it was trying to be deep. It merely salvaged what it could in order to keep some semblance of a story. Seriously man play Suda's earlier games to see how sophisticated his writing style really is. It's too bad that Suda likes to write all this over the top bullshit (K7, NMH) for his international audience, but ah well somebody seriously needs to tell Suda that he'd be even more successful if he brought over his Silver Case/Moonlight Syndrome (They're basically the same game.) style for a world wide audience. I honestly don't give a fuck about Killer 7. I care more about the world that Killer 7 is based off of. In fact with my next update I was actually planning to use a Moonlight Syndrome themed layout. To further distance this site from Killer 7. If I could change the name of this site from Killer 7 SINdicate to SUDA 51's "Kill the Past" or some other lame shit I would. Unfortunately the name is stuck here, because K7 is the entry point into Suda's game world for most of us. (Myself included.) K7 is just a stepping stone imo, not the core. As long as you understand the politics of Killer 7, than you should all be set. That's all you really need to know to understand Killer 7. However if you wish to understand more about the setting of Suda's games. Than I would advise one to track down the earlier titles, because not only are they more compelling than K7. They also make a lot more sense. (Except FSR. You need to play Silver Case in order to "get" that game.)

I didn't know my comments will disturb your ego to the extent of you using foullanguage and getting personal (out of gaming context), but you know '?' means that i am inquiring(what 'is' the case) 'not' that i am CLAIMING(that 'this' is the case and you are selfsatisfying). it wasnt deliberate insult as you put it, i call it your premature evaluation. It was ?:?: not !:!: I was straight , i wont hold anything back, no veiled shit , did i ever?, and i m not fond of using foullangauge either ('on people' like you), it doesn't achieve anyhting, and for me an immature act. You could have said simply that i am not emotionally involved but doing it as duty to make the forums alive and keeping informed, rather than long abusive rant.

Hand in Killer7: ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- AY: ORACLE <"Oracle" describes the twins who appear in children's forms.> "You shall be keen, traveler." ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- (1) The twins are 108 years old. (2) In accordance with prophecy, they appeared in the image of two boys. (3) The twins represent opposites: day and night, past and future, heavenly light and diabolical darkness. (4) They are Mithra, the god of contract. Let me guess, I am the only one so stupid to get the reference only now?

Good find. I've never noticed. I mean shit, it's so obvious & it flew directly under my radar. Moonlight Syndrome the game was all about people who were getting screwed by the god of contract, Mithra. I guess K7 has more connections to Moonlight Syndrome than I initially thought. (I figured that only the blinking moon had any real relevance to K7.) This makes the Mika Kishi connection all the more feasible. Here I am hoping that Mitra will appear in Fatal Frame 4. Without even realizing that he already made a re appearance in K7. I'm actually writing up Mitra's profile as we speak. Looks like I'll have to add this piece of info that you found to his page. This kinda makes me wonder if Kun Lan is related to anybody from either Moonlight Syndrome or Silver Case. That Parpiner chick that Kun Lan is said to be descended from could probably be Muholland Mother. Kun Lan does have red eyes & ultra pale skin after all. (I don't have a picture of Mulholland Mother, but I do have pics of characters who resemble her.) They too, look pretty similar to Kun Lan. Never really put much thought about it. I didn't even notice that those two kids with the grandpa voices were wearing the same exact clothes as Mitra from Moonlight Syndrome. Here's the Silver Case chart that has the only pic of Mulholland (Marionette) Mother that I've ever seen. http://killer7.3dactionplanet.gamespy.com/silvercasechartenglish.JPG

Funny, that Mithra thing only dropped on me last night when I was taking my dogs for a walk. That Parpiner chick that Kun Lan is said to be descended from could probably be Muholland Mother. You mean Mara Papima? That's not a chick (it may be if you want him to, though), but Kun Lan himself. Kun Lan is said to be a reincarnation of him. Mara Papima is actually the "king" of the Mara. It's the Buddhist equivalent of the christian devil, if you will, who's only purpose is to prevent Buddha (and you. Which is to say, the Buddha may be yourself) from developping a third eye (enlightment), by clouding his mind with trivialities like carnal activities, which is why Mara often assumes the form of a woman, or several women in order for Buddha to never achieve the highest plane. (Which is why, in my version of the story, Kun Lan doesn't have the same appearance as in the game, but more like an androgynous, or even female look, in order to appear seductive)

To reanswer a question... Is the creepy old man at the beginning that principal you talk about? His name is Aramata (Or Araki. I keep forgetting.) http://killer7.3dactionplanet.gamespy.com/moonsin2.htm#ara The journalist who records the events of the Twilight Syndrome. Aramata appears in every Twilight Syndrome game. Trying to document any new discoveries that he may find. He functions as the save point for Moonlight Syndrome. At first glance many people assume that Aramata is some sort of shady antagonist, but he's really just a character who keeps tabs on the effects of the Twilight Syndrome. (He exists outside of the story. He never interferes. He only watches.) Really? I was convinced that you already knew that, because it seemed so obvious. I never payed much attention to them, because they seemed irrelevant to Killer 7. I don't really check the HIK 7 translation much either. I usually just look at info contained within the game. (Although most seem to think otherwise.) I have no excuse for not noticing that Mithra wears the same exact attire in both K7 & MS. In a way they probably are irrelevant (to K7), but they do play a bigger role in Suda 51's world. Mithra's appearance alone confirms the Moonlight Syndrome connection. He's the mothafucker who makes the moon go crazy in the first place. Add to that a woman named Yayoi (She also looks like a grown up version of the Yayoi from Moonlight Syndrome.) was also in FSR. Moonlight Syndrome (the loading screens, the tv medium and Mithra) F.S.R. (Edo Macallister, Katharine) Silver Case (the silver eye/shelter children policy ripoffs, the order of the chapters and again the loading screens) and NMH. (Well, actually is no more heroes referring to killer7) Moonlight Syndrome also has the moonlight loading screens. That's where they originated from. In Silver Case they actually write the words Moonlight Syndrome (In Japanese) the first couple times that you see the blinking full moon scenes. Actually I think the blinking moon came from Twilight Syndrome. Moonlight Syndrome & Twilight Syndrome (The syndrome not the games.) are basically the same phenomenon. (It's just two different names that refer to the same syndrome.) I wouldn't be too surprised if Suda references the Moonlight Syndrome during Fatal Frame 4. Killer 7 rips off a lot more from SC than that, but it doesn't matter since SC & K7 are both made by Suda. I see K7 as the world that's already united as one. SC is the world that's on the road to establishing a new world order. Killer7 was released three years ago and we are still discovering new things I hear ya. I only wished that the information contained here were more wide spread. I haven't made the Mithra page yet. Still working on his profile in the Moonlight SYndrome page. Funny, that Mithra thing only dropped on me last night when I was taking my dogs for a walk. That Parpiner chick that Kun Lan is said to be descended from could probably be Muholland Mother. You mean Mara Papima? That's not a chick (it may be if you want him to, though), but Kun Lan himself. Kun Lan is said to be a reincarnation of him. (Which is why, in my version of the story, Kun Lan doesn't have the same appearance as in the game, but more like an androgynous, or even female look, in order to appear seductive) You mean he was called Papima this entire time? Damn I'm blind I thought it said Parpiner. (No wonder I couldn't find his name in any mythology books at all.) I figured that since Mara Parpiner wasn't in any SMT games, that it most likely didn't exist. I only called Mara a girl, because the guy who wrote the plot faq/hik 7 translation addresses Mara as a female. Now I'm beginning to understand that piece of information more clearly now. It at least adds more credence to my belief that Kun Lan in the game is actually just a tulpa. (A Tibetan thought form. Most Tibetans are Buddhist.) I wonder what's the story behind Mulholland Mother anyway? That's why I can't wait for the SC/FSR games to be translated. So I can see other view points. That help build upon my understanding of the games. BTW Mara in the Megaten games is a giant dick.

I've found the word spelled "Papimer" as well. But the info on the web is scarce. Which Megaten game is that from? Lol, that makes me wonder about the classic portrayal of demons and all that. What's so evil about them? If I were to portray my impression on a demon on page, both its looks and what it does, I'd probably have it rated X and burned right after that. Take the portrayal of demons in movies like End of Days. The hell? The Devil's evil deeds are limited to killing people in car accidents and shit? How distinctively evil...! Now I see why he's got his reputation as the prince of darkness. Now things like that Megaten demon are a bit closer to the mark. Imagine Schwarzenegger fighting something like that at the endgame. "I'M A COP YOU IDIOT!!!"

How bout her? Mara has been one giant ass dick ever since the first SMT game. That picture came from Devil Summoner 2 Soul Hackers In SMT III, Mara only appears as a giant tip of a penis. (you have to kill him before his evocation ritual is complete.) I pretty much use the Megaten games as my mythology encyclopedia. SMT games pretty much cover entities from all sets of beliefs. (With the main divinities being Indian in origin.) Now things like that Megaten demon are a bit closer to the mark. Imagine Schwarzenegger fighting something like that at the endgame. "I'M A COP YOU IDIOT!!!" Yeah Kazuma Kaneko & Cozy Okada for that matter are well versed in mythology, demonology, & the occult. You can clearly see their influence in the games that they make. Many people misunderstand the role of YWHW in SMT. Many people assume that the SMT creators made him the bad guy, because he's a Western god. Kaneko only made him the main antagonist, because YWHW has the most followers. There are more people in the world who would die in the name of Jehovah than anyone else. What I like about Megaten games is that unlike Final Fantasy. Megaten games actually stay true to the way most of these divinities are portrayed within their original culture that they sprang from. The rationale that SMT uses is that most demons & gods are make believe, and they only exist, because we believe in them. Example: I follow God's plan, because god directed me to do so. How do we know god exists? We only believe him to be true, because we have it set in our mind that it's impossible for him to not exist. ("We" is theoretical. I'm not saying that I believe that. I'm agnostic.) I don't know haw to explain it. I think what SMT is saying about the spiritual/paranormal. If such entities do indeed exist. (The following is my interpretation. I can't comprehend the shit that Kaneko says, because I'm not well versed in demonology like he is.) I believe that they would most likely take on the form of materialized thought forms that manifested shape through the collective will & belief of the world's populace. The thought forms themselves exist merely as concentrated energy that only take shape whenever the collective will enforces their beliefs & or influence over the source of energies in question. They exist, only when we believe. The semblance of intelligence or ego that they inhabit is merely a reflection of our own. Most religious people see what they call the "devil", because that's what they believe in. (Or have been indoctrinated to believe in.) I only see balls of flashing light. I'm aware of many interpretations, but I have not yet decided which to believe in. (I think it's all bullshit.) So I usually just see what's in front of me. (Or what I assumed to be in front of me.) In the SMT games, demons usually only take shape according to the characters set of beliefs. Which is why even Adolf Hitler & Nyalarthotep play an integral role in the Persona games. (Pre P3.) It's the Buddhist equivalent of the christian devil, if you will, who's only purpose is to prevent Buddha (and you. Which is to say, the Buddha may be yourself) from developping a third eye (enlightment), by clouding his mind with trivialities like carnal activities, which is why Mara often assumes the form of a woman, or several women in order for Buddha to never achieve the highest plane. Wow, now this pretty much explains how Kun Lan was able to masquerade as Angel. In the intro scenario.

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